Re: [ARSCLIST] Granz and JATP (Was:Sinatra & Ella)

[John Ross <johnross@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

After digging around on the Internet and skimming through "Making 
People's Music; Moe Asch and Folkways Records," by Peter Goldsmith, I 
think I have reconstructed the JATP release history:

o       Volume 1 was released on Asch-Stinson from recordings of the 
1944 JATP concert(s). Stinson continued to release their version into 
at least the 1960s.
o       After Asch split from Stinson (in 1946?), Granz continued to 
provide additional JATP material to Asch and his Disc label. Disc 
issue Volumes 2 - 5 plus some other items identified as "JATP."
o       In the spring of 1947, Granz's contract with Disc ended, but 
Moe Asch continued to release the JATP material. It took several 
years for Granz to get the masters from Disc.
o       Around 1949, Granz licensed the JATP rights to Mercury.
o       In the meantime, Granz established his own label, which 
ultimately changed names from Clef to NorGran to Verve. When the 
Mercury licenses ran out (1952?), he re-issued the JATP masters on Clef.

John Ross


At  7/8/2008 03:48 PM, you wrote:
> I have several volumes of JATP on Mercury 78's. They are definitely 
> badged Mercury and have "Norman Granz Presents" on the label.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Lennick" <dlennick@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <ARSCLIST@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 2:48 PM
> Subject: Re: [ARSCLIST] Granz and JATP (Was:Sinatra & Ella)
>
>
> > The first JATP album was definitely on Asch-Stinson (did it ever 
> > appear on pre-Stinson Asch?). Granz took the masters to Moe. Disc 
> > got Volume II (did this appear in various forms on ten-inch and 
> > twelve-inch and with 2 discs and 3? I seem to remember variant 
> > versions of it). Then, over to Clef for remaining volumes, and 
> > there were some sets that appeared both on Disc and Clef (like The 
> > Groove Juice Symphony).
> >
> > dl
> >
> > John Ross wrote:
> > > Were  first JATP releases on Mercury? I have a Fall 1946 Disc 
> > > Catalog that includes about half a dozen Norman Granz productions, 
> > > including "Jazz at the Philharmonic--Vol 2" (Disc Album 501) and 
> > > several other "-- at the Philharmonic" items. There's no "Vol. 1" 
> > > in the catalog, which suggests that it might have been issued by 
> > > somebody else. I don't think Moe Asch ever took anything out of 
> > > his catalog voluntarily.
> > >
> > > Disc was Moe Asch's label before he established Folkways. At some 
> > > point, he went into a partnership with Stinson, which led to many 
> > > of the early "Folksay" things appearing on both labels after they 
> > > split apart. There were several JATP releases on Stinson, probably 
> > > with some of the same material as the Norgran/Verve titles.
> > >
> > > How did Disc and Stinson fit into the release history of the JATP 
> > > recordings?
> > >
> > > John Ross
> > >
> > > At  7/8/2008 05:50 AM, Tom Fine wrote:
> > > > One man's opinion here -- Norman Granz never gets the credit he 
> > > > deserves. I think there were some animosities with the 
> > > > self-appointed "experts" and "critics" back in the Verve days, 
> > > > and that might have something to do with it. He also didn't write 
> > > > an autobiography (at least that I know of), unfortunately. This 
> > > > guy built three distinct and great catalogs of jazz -- 1) the 
> > > > Jazz at the Philharmonic live recordings, and the related 
> > > > in-studio jam sessions (first released through Mercury and then 
> > > > through Norgran/Verve), 2) the excellent Verve studio recordings 
> > > > of the 50's that continued even after Granz sold the label to 
> > > > MGM, 3) and then, out of retirement, the Pablo catalog, which has 
> > > > some weak spots but also proves the amazing longevity of some of 
> > > > the jazz greats.